Long, Hard, and Fast in General Discussion Forum

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Long, Hard, and Fast

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Trikathlon	Long, Hard, and Fast	Lead	[-]
Posts: 18 Dec 13 11 7:50 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Tags : None The title may be somewhat misleading :P I intend to ask a serious question as I am about to drop some dough on a new 700. I'll give my stats first then ask my question. 34 years old 6'4"ish 195lbs prior Army so very little fat on me, hurrah for physical fitness current DF average speed is 17-19 on the deck and 21-26 in the drops fairly strong motor With the supplied attributes, what would be the typical or expected transition as far as speed is concerned by switching to a catrike 700? I'm expecting long hard and fast rides. 50miles+, cadence of 90+, 26+mph Am I expecting or hoping for too much? I understand bent muscles are different than DF's so I'm not expecting all of this instantly. I do not expect to be riding with any gear except what I need to go out and come back, ie: water, extra tubes, air, tool, etc. I live in Houston so long, straight, and flat roads abound.
texpug		#1	[-]
Posts: 1730 Dec 13 11 8:56 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Have you ridden a 700? I live around Houston and have 2. Naked -- no "stuff" on them. You can come ride mine if you want to.
evensteven		#2	[-]
Posts: 405 Dec 14 11 3:45 AM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Its good to have goals. Yours will take some training. I'm about the same height and weight, so you will need the extra long boom option. Mine is out almost all the way. The biggest thing I find coming from a DF is not really being able to stand on the pedals and use your body weight to push rpm. Also, with the feet out in front and slightly elevated, if you push too hard you may experience 'Hot Foot'. So I find the trike works better with more spin and less mash. 90 rpm is good for me too. Now go get a 700!
steamer		#3	[-]
Posts: 46 Dec 14 11 5:07 AM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	I am going to be the stick in the mud here. The recumbent fastest trikes out there (the 700 is definitely a contender for the title) are still quite a bit slower than the fastest recumbent bikes. Keep this in mind.
Trikathlon		#4	[-]
Posts: 18 Dec 14 11 8:31 AM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	No, I haven't ridden a 700. Unfortunately the LBS's that sell recumbents 'round here don't have hardly anything but crank forwards or tera-trikes. Never ridden a catrike since no one stocks them here. I thought about a recum-bike as well but I like the idea of sitting at a light without taking my feet off the pedals. If I were going to purchase a bike it would probably be a Baron or an M5. A little out of my range atm. This will also be used to ride with the wife as she isn't a fast rider or interested in anything faster than say 5-10 mph. So, it will see double duty as a slow ride and as a distance/speed machine. Edit: After looking at the Optima and M5 websites I've seen the cost for a Baron is around $2500 and the M5carbon is $4400 The M5carbon is clearly out of my range but possible in the CrMo form at $2300. The Baron and M5 CrMo are less than I expected so they may be in the running. I could use my DF for the family rides I suppose. I'm tempted to go two wheeled but concerned about low speed handling. Thoughts? Last Edited By: Trikathlon Dec 14 11 9:01 AM. Edited 1 times.
texpug		#5	[-]
Posts: 1730 Dec 14 11 9:21 AM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	I sent you a PM.
MtBiker77		#6	[-]
Posts: 46 Dec 14 11 11:52 AM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	A Baron or anything similar is going to be a ton of fun, but not at jogging/running speeds with your wife--both because of low speed handling and because Ferraris are no fun in 1st gear. In that case, I say get a Catrike so you can look at all the things overhead that you ordinarily miss flying around on your DF.
Richard B Clarke		#7	[-]
Posts: 634 Dec 14 11 1:15 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	As a 700 owner who also likes to ride fast I would say to go for it . As far as it being slower then a 2 wheeled recumbent , I would say that depends. It has been my experience that the 700 is quite fast . I also agree that a carbon fiber optima baron would be faster, but for me it would not be as fun as a 700. Plus I would rather be on my 700 on any down hill technical road. YEMV. Also, for me if I had look at the Baron or similar, than I would stick with my road DF Last Edited By: Richard B Clarke Dec 14 11 2:04 PM. Edited 1 times.
trplay		#8	[-]
Posts: 499 Dec 14 11 2:07 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Seems the Musashi is the perfect fit here. They are still taking orders through December and it is one of the top user friendly two wheel recumbents for novices and its a fast rascal too. Great slow speed handling and it will give a "fairly strong" motor a chance of reaching the stated speeds. It sounds to me like you are over estimating your performance hopes on the Trike but I could be wrong. Perhaps someone can chime in and provide some real world examples of 26 mph averages over distances 50 and beyond?
devious56		#9	[-]
Posts: 2717 Dec 14 11 2:49 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	trplay wrote: Seems the Musashi is the perfect fit here. They are still taking orders through December and it is one of the top user friendly two wheel recumbents for novices and its a fast rascal too. Great slow speed handling and it will give a "fairly strong" motor a chance of reaching the stated speeds. It sounds to me like you are over estimating your performance hopes on the Trike but I could be wrong. Perhaps someone can chime in and provide some real world examples of 26 mph averages over distances 50 and beyond? Not me. But, I was a fairly fast df rider in spite of my age, and was able to do centuries averageing over 20 mph on my df. Not so on my trike, either the Expediton or Speed. This is an old argument, but an Expedition is almost as fast as a 700, and my Speed was faster then my Expedition. Now here's the disclamer, my century times on the Expediton were between 16 and 17 mph on the best day. And I would certainly take to heart what EvenSteven has to say as he is probably one of the fastest Catrikers out there. David
evensteven		#10	[-]
Posts: 405 Dec 14 11 3:32 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Thanks, David. Uh...your cheque is in the mail. When I was new to recumbents, I thought I wanted a Challenge Taifun after seeing this photo. A store in Toronto had one, so off I went for a test ride. Then Carey, the shop's recumbent guru started me off on a Rans, with a big seat and upright riding position. I wobbled around through different models all afternoon, getting closer to that Taifun lowracer. When I test rode it, I was almost sure it was for me. About a 1/2 hour before closing, I nearly tripped over this low thing on the floor. A blue Road. I took it for a rest ride, but I was sure it would be too impractical for daily use. But it was so fun, like a go-cart. I went home and thought about it over and over. A few weeks later, this baby was mine and I've never looked back. If at all possible, do test ride as much and many as you can find.
texpug		#11	[-]
Posts: 1730 Dec 14 11 5:26 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	You're welcome to come out to my neck of the woods adn try both my 700's! You really need to. You may find that you just don't like them. Better to make the haul out here than to sink big bucks into one that you may not be happy with.
swisstrike		#12	[-]
Posts: 181 Dec 15 11 7:42 AM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	I am always slower on my 700 than on my DF. Then only exception would be strong head wind. On a 112miles rides it takes me between 7h and 7h45 on the DF my best solo time was 6h flat. Usually it will take me 5h45-6h40 when riding with 1-2 other riders. 5h15 my all time best but there where like 1,500 riders an most of the time I was hiding in a pack. That being said I love my 700 and I always have a giant smile while I ride or step off it. Long distance touring with the 700 is even more fun. Absolutely no regrets I would agree it is worth testing them to see which one you like best
Trikathlon		#13	[-]
Posts: 18 Dec 15 11 8:17 AM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	From what I've read I have come to the conclusion that either the 700's are not being pushed as hard as they could be or my impression of their speed capabilities were exaggerated. I need to test the 700 and probably an expedition but I'm mainly concerned about top speed. I have no problem pushing 90+rpm for extended periods but I do have a problem of not being faster than my DF, especially with the aerodynamics that a recumbent brings to the table. Is there a disproportionate amount of riders who only want to toot around town and thus are pushing the perceived speeds lower or should I expect to hit 25+ all the time on an average day. Tbh, if I can't hit at least 20mph easily, it's not even worth my time. I understand that I will need some time to build my recumbent legs. I'm not concerned about looking around or smelling the flowers.
Richard B Clarke		#14	[-]
Posts: 634 Dec 15 11 9:17 AM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	Trikathlon wrote: From what I've read I have come to the conclusion that either the 700's are not being pushed as hard as they could be or my impression of their speed capabilities were exaggerated. I need to test the 700 and probably an expedition but I'm mainly concerned about top speed. I have no problem pushing 90+rpm for extended periods but I do have a problem of not being faster than my DF, especially with the aerodynamics that a recumbent brings to the table. Is there a disproportionate amount of riders who only want to toot around town and thus are pushing the perceived speeds lower or should I expect to hit 25+ all the time on an average day. Tbh, if I can't hit at least 20mph easily, it's not even worth my time. I understand that I will need some time to build my recumbent legs. I'm not concerned about looking around or smelling the flowers. First of all most of the negative comments about the 700 you are basing your conclusions on are from people who do not own them. Secondly there no trikes that will give you the performance equal to a performance DF. However of the lot the 700 will come the closest. Third what I would do is solisit the manufacturers opinion as to what they think is the one that best meets your performance needs......Hint check out their web site. Fourth, realize that a lot of what you get on forums such as this are opinions at best . And finally test ride and form your own opinion
evensteven		#15	[-]
Posts: 405 Dec 15 11 9:30 AM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	I think there is some truth in the 700 not being pushed as hard as it could be. I don't think trikes should be thought of as slower than 2wheelers, when designed for racing, without fairings. 20mph should not be a problem for you (and I don't know you, but from what you posted), and 26mph for 26 miles (let alone 50) would be a record. Alot of riders come to recumbents later in life or after some kinda injury, so you would be one of the youngest trikers around, and I'd like to see what you could do with a 700. I started with an expedition, and about 6 months later test rode a 700. That was it. I knew right away I wanted one. It took another year of waiting before I could get that 700. I still have both, the expedition now has fat tires on it and I use it off road.
swisstrike		#16	[-]
Posts: 181 Dec 15 11 11:04 AM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	I totally agree the 700 can be a fast beast. But I never really feel like racing on it 90rpm and 18mph is pretty standard for me in the DF (we have some hills around here) On the cat I just want to enjoy the day and the world. There is always a good reason to slow down, A nice view, flowers, a smile, ... For people to get it I use the following analogy: The 700 is like a big Harley and my DF like a ducatti (or Japanese race motorbike) . You could hammer with the Harley around a race track but that is not where you enjoy it most. AS for the case bike take it on to a multi day ride and every part of your body will hurt in some way. I enjoy both and pick what works best. For a work out it is the DF and big hills, to enjoy live a have an ear to ear grin on my face it is the 700
mikeatlbch		#17	[-]
Posts: 3400 Dec 18 11 5:07 PM Reply Quote More My Recent Posts	If you look at HPRA Florida 2011 results you can have some numbers for comparison between recumbent bikes and trikes. John Schlitter on his Bacchetta is the National 24h champion 2010, completed RAAM 2009 as a soloist and was a cat 2 racer when younger. Steve and Mark and Jorge are fun trikers...and happen to be fast among trikers. Look at Results from the 12h race in Sebring in 2011 as well. Again, Steve showed the bikes that he could ride with the fast paceline, even if he couldn't get much draft off them. I always seem like I can go faster on bikes, but when I look at my best 200m speeds they all are around 29mph whether I have used my trike or a bike. (In a fully faired trike I have gone 34mph) I always tell folks they will be slower, but some of that issue is because you can go as slow as you want on a trike. That is really nice if one partner who is faster or slower will wait for you or bring out your patience. And take texpug up on her offer to try a 700. While it does take a little riding time to get acclimated to the position, I think you will find the grin. Last Edited By: mikeatlbch Dec 18 11 5:20 PM. Edited 2 times.

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